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Scandinavian Commonwealth Flag Evolution by Rarayn Scandinavian Commonwealth Flag Evolution by Rarayn
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Final flag fav.me/d421y3c

Map fav.me/d428kol

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Commentary:
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I have always wanted to make one of these, so I figured I'd make one for my Commonwealth of Scandinavia flag, even if it wasn't all that hard to see what came from where on it.

I stole the idea of making it school book-ish from Sapiento, who did something similar with this: fav.me/d207kxa

Norway's flag is a white saltire on red in this TL mostly out of convenience, but it was indeed one of the first Norwegian flag proposals from 1814, so it's not as if it doesn't make any sense. (As seen here: www.stortinget.no/PageFiles/94… )

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Resources:
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Paper texture www.sycha.com/10-free-high-res…
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:iconrphb:
rphb Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2015
This is wrong in so many ways.
1) it is not how the norwegian flag looks like
2) Scandinavia already have a union flag. Which is a Standard Scandinavian crossflag that is yellow with a red cross
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2015
1) The white on red saltire was one of the very first proposals for a Norwegian flag historically, predating the one now in use by a few years. You are correct in that it wasn't actually used, but this is an allohistorical scenario where it was. It was mostly just an excuse to make a Union Jack-esque flag for Scandinavia though.

2) The union flag you describe is the alleged flag of the Kalmar Union. There is little to no proof of it ever having been used, and even if it was, it wouldn't be relevant to a Scandinavian union formed in the 19th century.
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:iconrphb:
rphb Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2015
It would be extremely relevant yes, and it is the symbol of pan scandinavianism today, Which I number myself a part of.
A Scandinavian union needs a common flag, and there is already a consensus on how it will look like.
And just looking at thine maps it seems to be a bit naive.
"the holy german empire"? I am sure thou meant "the holy roman empire of the german nation".
An empire that had been torn apart a long time before its final demise in 1806 by nationalism.

It is easy to imagine that many things would have been different but it still needs to follow logically.
One scenario that I imagine could have led to a vastly different world is if Lief Eriksons Vinland collony had been a success.
After initial success with establishing a Vinland colony on what we know as Newfoundland, the vikings sailed further south down the coast and established contact with the rich mesoamerican indians. That lead to the establishment of the cocao-iron road, from Mexico, over Vinland, Greenland and Iceland, to Norway and the rest of Scandinavia and Europe.

That trading route lead to great wealth flowing into the Kingdom of Norway that was able to dominate the other Scandinavian states and form the High Kingdom of Scandinavia.
The trade route lead to an exchange of resources, technologies and diseases to travel over the Atlantic. The Vikings would not be able to conquer north America, but by the time Ocean going ships able to cross the Atlantic were invented, Christopher Columbus would find Caribbean island inhibited by Vikings and a mainland America filled with skrællinger immune to the European diseases, who were ridding horses and carrying steal blades just like his men.
Mexico might be partially submitted with time like India and China, but never fully conquered like it were, and the continent would never have been "empty" for settlement, so the Europeans would never have a place to emigrate to and and USA would never have formed. Also the unified Scandinavia would have been able to challenge the United Kingdom to such an extend that it never would have been able to rule the seas. There would be shifting alliances between Scandinavia, Spain, France, the Netherlands and England that would have ensured that no country would have acquired total dominance like England had under the 19th century.

Futhermore, a unified Scandinavia would have been able to keep Holmgård would likely also have maintained Kænugård in their empire, which would have ensured that it would remain a truly great power in Europe equal to that of France, The Holy Roman Empire and the United Kingdom.
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2015
I'm not sure what you are referring to with the "Holy German Empire" part of your comment. Do you have a link to the map you saw it on?
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:iconrphb:
rphb Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2015
ah its in thy favorite stack rarayn.deviantart.com/art/MoF-…,
not one thou made theeself.
Still alternative history map is only fun to a certain point, what is really interesting is constructing an alternative setting for an interesting story like the one I am working on now
Reply
:icon11monar:
11monar Featured By Owner May 29, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
It´s really interesting, a beliveable combination of the three flags. But which symbols would be put in the middle of the flag if a king of Norway or Denmark became the Samväldeskonung instead? Just curious :)
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner May 29, 2013
Norway would use its golden lion on red while Denmark would use its three blue lions on yellow. Not sure if it would look as aesthetically pleasing though, hah.
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:icon11monar:
11monar Featured By Owner Jun 1, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
who knows :)
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:iconphantomdotexe:
phantomdotexe Featured By Owner Apr 7, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Who knows? Maybe someday.
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:icondevineemperormeiji:
DevineEmperorMeiji Featured By Owner Oct 14, 2012
Holy mahjolee. That is awesome
Reply
:iconnazjaraj:
NazjaRaj Featured By Owner Jun 16, 2012  Student Digital Artist
Kalmar union in an AH. priceless.
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Jun 17, 2012
The Kalmar Union was dissolved as it was OTL. This is a different beast entirely. ;)
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:iconienkoron:
Ienkoron Featured By Owner Jan 10, 2012
"Norway's flag is a white saltire on red in this TL mostly out of convenience, but it was indeed one of the first Norwegian flag proposals from 1814, so it's not as if it doesn't make any sense."

Now the Swedish War Ensign of 1815-1844 makes sense to me, in my flag book it shows the white Saltire on red in the canton of the swallow tailed Swedish flag but no explanation why. Thank you for clearing that up :D
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Jan 11, 2012
I don't know for sure if that's the reason it was used on the Swedish-Norwegian War Ensign, but it is a possibility, yeah. I've yet to see any sources that confirm or deny it, anyway.
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:iconienkoron:
Ienkoron Featured By Owner Jan 12, 2012
It makes sense if it was though, and more so to me now.
Reply
:icontrygveblacktiger:
trygveblacktiger Featured By Owner Dec 3, 2011  Hobbyist Digital Artist
ithink if norway danmek and sweden have make one big empier we have kiced austia and pussia
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Dec 6, 2011
One shouldn't underestimate the Prussians, but we'd probably be able to beat them back, if nothing else. ;)
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:iconi-teach-you-ha:
I-Teach-You-Ha Featured By Owner Sep 15, 2011  Hobbyist
i would like to life in that sweden!
good job
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Sep 15, 2011
Just remember not to call it Sweden when there are any Danes or Norwegians present. :XD:

Thanks!
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:iconi-teach-you-ha:
I-Teach-You-Ha Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2011  Hobbyist
but wait a second, dont them listen to sweden?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2011
The Commonwealth is built with the brotherhood and equality of all three Scandinavian people in mind, so even if Sweden is the politically dominant part of it, simply calling the Commonwealth "Sweden" would probably not please the non-Swedish members of it.
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:iconi-teach-you-ha:
I-Teach-You-Ha Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2011  Hobbyist
well that make sense then oxo;
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:iconi-teach-you-ha:
I-Teach-You-Ha Featured By Owner Sep 15, 2011  Hobbyist
oh right sorry
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:iconspineless-laugh:
spineless-laugh Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
...no.
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
...What?
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:iconspineless-laugh:
spineless-laugh Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
The Swedish king ruling Denmark! ;)
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
The Scandinavian Commonwealth is not a Kalmar-model personal union, but a federal monarchy with one king for each kingdom, with one of those three also filling the role of king of the Commonwealth as a whole. :3
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:iconnivekvonbeldo:
NivekVonBeldo Featured By Owner Aug 31, 2011  Hobbyist Writer
That is like German Empire(with the king of prussia as Emperor but with both king of Bavaria, Saxony and wutterberg) with denmark being the bavaria of Scandinavia?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 31, 2011
That was essentially what I had in mind, yes. :3
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:iconspineless-laugh:
spineless-laugh Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
Oh... er. Okay.
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:iconspiritswriter123:
Spiritswriter123 Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
what did you use to make this? Gimp 2.6? Open Office Draw?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
GIMP 2.6, though any graphics editing software that supports layers would do fine.
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:iconnivekvonbeldo:
NivekVonBeldo Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011  Hobbyist Writer
pretty nice to represent how the flag born.. and know the flag have much more sense
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Glad you liked it. :D
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:iconsapiento:
Sapiento Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011  Professional Digital Artist
Cool!
Thanks for the reference!
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Thank you. :D

No problem, the evolution of the Britavian flag has had me interested for a long time now.
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:iconaydeezy:
AYDeezy Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Nice flag.
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Thanks!
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:iconmdc01957:
mdc01957 Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Pretty impressive stuff as always. Also, I like how it sort-of parallels the flag history of the UK.
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Thank you. :3

The Union Jack is pretty much the ultimate union flag, so it's difficult to make a good flag with crosses and saltires without creating any parallels to it.
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:iconmdc01957:
mdc01957 Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Very true. Though are there other alternatives/parallels?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
There aren't all that many union flags like this IRL, I think. It's just that a lot of AH union flags tend to take a similar path if the flags in question use similar elements.
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:iconmdc01957:
mdc01957 Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
I've seen a few flags back in the forum that tried to use Poland-Lithuania or Austria-Hungary as a reference...and I'll leave the criticisms to you. ;)
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
The Poland-Lithuania flag always looked Austrian to me. :XD:

I have done a different kind of union flag myself too (Courland-Prussia, flag 3), which is more along the lines of the Austria-Hungary one, but whenever crosses and saltires enter the mix, flags tend to end up taking a Union Jack-ish route.
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:iconmdc01957:
mdc01957 Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
I guess it happens. :XD:

Also, have you checked that journal entry yet, by any chance?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2011
Just commented~
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(1 Reply)
:iconjewkowski:
Jewkowski Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Wait, isn't Finland Scandinavian too?
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
Finland is Nordic, not Scandinavian. It's a semi-independent kingdom under influence from the German Empire in this timeline, and is not part of the Scandinavian Commonwealth. Check the map I linked to under "Extra information" to see the full extent of the Commonwealth.
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:iconheersander:
HeerSander Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
I think that, in his alternate reality, Finland is a part of Russia
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:iconrarayn:
Rarayn Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2011
It's a semi-independent kingdom under the influence of the German Empire. See the map linked to under "Extra information" for more information.
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